Spooner Row Message Board

Post Info TOPIC: Re: Planning Application : 2019/0330 - Proposed Traveler Site
Lynn Kingsley

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Re: Planning Application : 2019/0330 - Proposed Traveler Site
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 Hi All,

I am rather concerned as I have heard on the grapevine that there are some people who are thinking of submitting  "anonymous" comments - whilst as many  comments as possible are needed regarding this application - and preferably before March 19th in order to get a good debate going at the Wymondham Town Council meeting! - I cannot stress how important it is to include names and addresses with your comment as anonymous submissions will automatically be REJECTED by the council.

After spending many months, 10 years ago,  on the Chepore Lane issue,  I  know that any comments made on a personal level will also be rejected - so make sure comments are based on the grounds of the application itself and only give factual reasons (that lay within the councils development /planning framework)  as to why the proposal should be "passed" or "rejected".

There is quite a lot of negativity about  - I've heard comments like   " ... what's the point of putting in an objection because it will go ahead anyway ......"  -  can I remind people that in 2008, when South Norfolk Council was performing their consultations whilst looking for locations for G & T sites -   we, collectively,  SUCCESSFULLY STOPPED the "Traveler Transit Site" that they were so intent on setting up !!  

I know the land was subsequently purchased and a permanent site was granted for the Gypsies - but we DID win the first round and PREVENTED the "Transit" site  - which would have been catastrophic for both the area and the residents if that had gone ahead as, in my opinion, we were definitely heading on the road to another "Dale Farm" outcome!

This situation is different from the "Consultation of a Transit Site" episode  - this is a straight forward Planning Application which goes through the the councils planning process like any other planning application submitted to them.   

HOWEVER _ although the METHODS for the Council in dealing with the two separate issues is "different" - in my considered opinion, the general feelings of the residents appear to be very much the same as they were 10 years ago!!

It is for this reason that I urge you to submit your comments ( including your name and address) as quickly as you can  - and if there are two or more in the house, submit them separately, not jointly!

We are one small community - if we all pull together, like we did in 2008, your comments CAN make a difference!!

Regards  - Lynn 



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Anonymous

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To submit your comments/support/objections send to:

Address: South Norfolk Council, Cygnet Court, Long Stratton, Norwich NR15 2XE

Email: planning@s-norfolk.gov.uk

On-line: https://info.south-norfolk.gov.uk/online-applications/applicationDetails.do?keyVal=PMK787OQ0FJ00&activeTab=summary

 



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Anonymous

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Lynn is correct in that we did stop a transit site operated by South Norfolk Council which would have been totally unsuitable at that location. This District Council initially tried to allow it through without anyone local knowing anything about it and with no public consultation, thankfully the local press reported it and we all became aware. The Council were wrong in the way they handled their proposed transit site from the outset, and everything they arranged after that such as public meetings were just a blatant formality. The Council's behaviour over the following months was actually reported in the national press and on TV!! It might have been 10 years ago, but many still remember the Council's poor attitude towards local people. 

This traveller site is a standard planning application and it will be South Norfolk Council who will vote and decide the outcome. 



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Julian halls

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WTC planning voted unanimously to refuse this application tonight

Now over to District with the hope that the District councillors who sit on the planning sub refuse this as well.

A real cynic might suggest  they will, just because they do not want a similar application on their patch and because there is clearly a driving force at SDC who want to get through no matter how valid the objections are.

It is pleasant to note that that none of the objections are personal or racist in nature but based on solid reasons and existing planning policy and guidance. Not the same can be said of the supporting letters which say the applicant is a nice chap and always goes to Church and pays his bills on time coupled with letters from Schools saying this would be good for the applicant's kids education.

It might help th kids but one has to question the validity of these letters in relation to the application and no one is saying there is an issue with the applicants themselves. Can you imagine an applicant submitting a plan to build a house next door to say Wymondham college so their children can attend there. It would get very short shrift  



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Lynn Kingsley

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I would like to extend our thanks to Wymondham Town Council for allowing us, local residents, to attend their meeting last night and voice our views on the proposed Traveler Site Planning Application.  We, and our comments, were treated with courtesy and questions were answered fully within their remit.   Many thanks indeed to all the committee members, and to Jack Hornby who attended the meeting and kindly stayed on afterwards to speak with us - all much appreciated!   Lynn.



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Anonymous

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The elections are in a few weeks time, so it's very likely that is why they stayed behind afterwards to speak to you - will they be speaking to you after the elections? 

Four years ago, they spoke to us promising to stop the speculative house building that nobody wanted, afterwards nothing changed and we were ignored. 

Maybe if there are votes in it for them you might get support for a short while. I am cynical but it is because of their previous actions or lack of when important matters need to be supported.



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Lynn Kingsley

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I do take your point and I do agree with your comments in general as, when it comes to elections, everyone standing for re-election will want to solicit as much support as they can - however, in this instance Jack Hornby stayed on as I had asked a question during the meeting that Wymondham Town Council was not able to answer as it came under the remit of South Norfolk and not them.  It was at the committee's suggestion that I spoke with Jack and he graciously agreed to do so after the meeting - hence my simple vote of thanks to him.   

I actually think he will continue to speak to us, although we'll hopefully (in the nicest possible way, need to speak with him if everyone makes sure their comments are sent in - there have been several lodged now, but the more comments the better, especially if they are objections !  -   It will be too late after the event if planning gets granted! 



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Daz

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I am concerned about the privacy issues when objecting to these planning applications. You have to leave your full name and address which is visible to the world and yet the applicant does not. This leaves you very exposed and vulnerable to abuse if the application is rejected as people will know who you are and where you live. Pehaps SNC can verify peoples submissions and remove the names and addresses to protect peoples idenities. 

I kniw a lot of local residents who are afraid to submit a comment because they do not want their names and addresses published for fear of reprisals.

Perhaps this is what SNC want so as to reduce objections to this type of application, keeping people afraid to stand up and speak.



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Robert Foster

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I have just spoken to Simon Marjoram, a Senior Planner at South Norfolk.  His response to the earlier posters privacy concerns was to recommend that the resident speak with the case officer and then email the comment but add a request that personal information be redacted when published on a public platform.

Claire Curtis is the Senior Planner dealing and she can be contacted on 01508 533788 or ccurtis@s-norfolk.gov.uk 

   

place onto the Planning Portal. 



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Anonymous

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Surely this should be the norm???

The default privacy setting for all public comments should not show names and addresses.

If people are happy for their private information to be publicly published on an open site, especially with these particular sensitivities, then it should be opt in.

SNC have got this completely back to front.

Privacy is a fundamental human right which means SNC are violating my human rights by only allowing my comments to be accepted and published if my name and address is included.

Surely the planning process must come under GDPR laws!



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Anonymous

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In reply to Daz, if anyone notices anything suspicious please ensure that you report it to the police and obtain an Incident Number so that it is properly recorded. and I mean anything.

In my opinion, the Council do not care, and the last time we were in this position 10 years ago, I felt that publishing our personal details (and other things) was used in such a way to put people off from objecting to the planning application. But we continued to object to it anyway and did not let this put us off.

I cannot see this application being successful as it is far too close to the existing traveller's site unless of course, it is predetermined and already a done deal, which wouldn't surprise me. 

 



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Lynn Kingsley

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Well done Robert - Excellent solution! - and it looks like someone has already taken advantage of getting round the non-published "name & address" issue on the SNC site - hopefully this will give confidence to others that want to voice their opinions without  fear of recrimination.

If so, don't forget, you must still let the council have your name and address, but neither will show when your objection get's published if you follow what Robert has already said.

If you have never raised an objection to anything before, it is very important to focus on "planning policy" and "objection quality" otherwise your objection will be rejected. 

 



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Anonymous

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This application has been extended to 28th June.



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Anonymous

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This will be decided by a planning committee mainly made up of councillors who don't even live here and in some cases, they don't live anywhere near here.

The submitted planning statement says that the travellers are known by an individual at South Norfolk Council. Does this mean they will be getting preferential treatment as I remembered what happened last time? 



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Anonymous

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Can I ask a question?

 

Is our new Parish Council going to add any comment to this application?

Can an attempt be made?



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Anonymous

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There is a news article in the Mercury about this planning application https://www.wymondhamandattleboroughmercury.co.uk/news/planning-application-for-eight-berth-traveller-site-at-suton-lodged-1-6042268

I can't remember SNC refusing any traveller site over the years. All I can remember is the Council giving the go-ahead to several sites despite strong local opposition. 



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Anonymous

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Lots of new documents have appeared on the planning portal under 2019/0330

plus the date has been extended another 21 days in case anybody wants to add further comments



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Anonymous

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Most of the additional documents are from the travelling community stating that they want to live a settled life. There needs to be a fair law that treats everyone the same. Would I be allowed to build a large caravan site in my garden or on a greenfield plot of land near a fast moving road to continue my settled life? Very unlikely. 

The proposed site is just metres from the existing traveller site and will result in this part of Suton having a disproportionate impact on the existing small settled community.

It's very likely that SNC will give permission to the traveller site - they are given preferential treatment.



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julian Halls

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In answer to the above personal statements all 9 of them dated the 18th , a happy coincidence? are INADMISSIBLE  when it comes to planning applications.

Objections MUST be on planning grounds only

The application which looks very similar to that previously although has added some flood control measures now comes before  the new Community council and a meeting will be held very shortly to discuss this application alone at an extraordinary meeting in the village hall

I am working up some dates for this

Please be mindful that we are consultees and do not have the power to block this but can ask for full public scrutiny. As a District councillor I have already asked that this be brought before the full planning comittee at South Norfolk ( no date ) where members of the public may speak , as can the applicant and objectors  BUT only for 5 minutes in total each

The officer is not time limited and neither are the ward members 

Please call if you have concerns but might be best to wait for the meeting

 

Julian Halls wring as Chair of Spooner row Community Council and South Wymondham District Ward councillor



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Anonymous

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Can SNC demonstrate within its planning policy and planning rules that there is a need for an additional traveller site in Suton and one that is extremely close to the existing one?



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julian Halls

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I have to eat humble pie

Apparently personal statements in respect to travellers site applications are permitted under special arrangements and Planning rules

This is new to me and was not what I was told yesterday but it would appear they forgot to tell me Travellers are allowed this because of the nature of their lifestyle

I have called a special meeting of the the community council to be held at the village Hall on the 4th July at 1930 to consider all comments from you as members of the public

 

Please pass onto everyone and anyone who is interested so we can record your input but please be mindful these must be on planning grounds

 



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Daz

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And why are we not allowed to mention our health in respect to this application Julian. Many of us have issues already exacerbated by the stress this is all causing, and what about if the application is passed??? 

Allowing travellers to make comments like this and not anyone else is prejudiced to every one except travellers which is illegal and immoral.

They like to play the race card and yet if i mention that my race is being abused or prejudiced against then i am ignored. Most of these travellers are white with european heritage, as am i, so race must not be used in applications like this. it is just their lifestyle choices that are different.



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Anonymous

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So travellers are permitted to use personal statements within the planning process but the rest of us are not, that doesn't seem very fair and equal. Once travellers become settled, do they still retain these extra rights which are based on their lifestyle?

Has SNC identified a specific need that this rural parish needs more than one traveller site? Is it sustainable and appropriate? The recent photos provided on the council's planning portal show significant flooding at that location which contradicts the flood risk assessment made on behalf of the applicant. Planning documents state that traveller sites should avoid impacts on local roads - NCC Highways has submitted its concerns relating to this. The B1172 already has existing problems, particularly at junctions due to the speed of traffic - what traffic calming systems will NCC be putting in place to slow traffic for public safety if this is approved? 

 



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julian Halls

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Dear All

 

I am pleased to say that the Planners at South norfolk have agreed to refuse this application on multiple grounds

 

The sting in the tail is that the applicant has already advised that they will appeal

 

Julian

 



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Anonymous

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I am pleased the council considered the multiple problems with this application before making its decision.

An appeal would be expensive.



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